The Cripple Who is Whole contact? Options

[dabenjita]

Yes I have read the series but I don't want to give away his identity for those of you who have not. Just wondering, if he was at the Beor Mountains, and the Cripple was in Ellesmera, who could he contact him from such a distance? When Eragon and Saphira's bond cannot be maintained from far how can The Cripple do this?

[AnswerMan]

some spell plus the power in his sword.

[zenron]

It is quite possible with the simplest of magic. I remember Arya saying that she could speak to Eragon on the gates of Vroengard(I can't spell it) just as easily as being stood right next to him.

The cripple who is whole has a vast store of energy though stored in his sword. It wouldn't be hard for him to do even the most complicated magic, even if he is weak himself.

[ND]

See if this helps:

Byrd asked: In Eldest, Arya tells Eragon that she can talk with him from the gates of Vroengard to the other side of Alagaësia. Why can Arya speak from such a long distance and Eragon and Saphira can't? Especially since he is now as strong as an Elf. And why could she not speak with him when he was in the Empire?

CP's Answer: Oh boy . . . You sure know how to ask tough questions! Okay, here goes:

1. 1. In Brisingr, Arya couldn't talk with Eragon when he was alone in the Empire because:
1. 1. She didn't know where he was.
2. 2. He was shielding his mind from all possible contact, in order to avoid detection by Murtagh or any other of Galbatorix's magic-wielding minions. (Wonderful word, minions.)
2. 2. As I looked back on the exchange you mentioned between Arya and Eragon in Eldest, I realized why you got confused. It's my own fault; I made an assumption that seemed perfectly sensible to me at the time, but which I should have explained a bit more clearly to everyone else. For those who don't remember, the pertinent section is (from page 148):

Arya nodded toward where Saphira undulated through the water. "I grew accustomed to Saphira's presence during the fifteen years I guarded her egg. I was reaching out for anything that felt familiar when I touched your dreams."

"Are you really strong enough to contact someone in Teirm from Gil'ead? Especially if you were drugged."

A ghost of a smile touched Arya's lips. "I could stand on the very gates of Vroengard and still speak with you as clearly as I am now."

When he asked his question, Eragon was asking about telepathy. That is, could Arya touch someone's mind in Teirm all the way from Gil'ead? Arya was not answering that question specifically, but rather the more general question, "Could you contact someone in Teirm all the way from Gil'ead?" And she could, only not with telepathy. Using the right spell, Arya could speak to Eragon from across the whole width of Alagaësia, even as Eragon speaks with Queen Islanzadí and others when he scrys them in Brisingr.

Arya's actually being rather glib here.

The thing to remember is that when Eragon saw Arya in his dreams, they weren't engaged in telepathy; they didn't exchange any thoughts or feelings, nor could they have even if they wanted to. What happened was that Arya transmitted (to use a modern term) an image of herself and her surroundings into Eragon's eyes/visual cortex, much the same way that two people who are scrying each other can transmit images of themselves and their surroundings onto a mirror or any other reflective surface in front of the other person. (Again, as in Brisingr.) And why can spellcasters do that but not read minds at great distances? Well that leads to my next point:
3. 3. Scrying and telepathy are fundamentally different processes. Both move objects from one point to another, but what they move isn't the same.
1. 1. Scrying involves reproducing the light at one location at another. The information required to do this is conveyed via electromagnetic radiation (visible or not) from point A to point B. By scrying another place, what a magician is doing is, essentially, funneling a stream of photons encoded with the visual information from his target to his own location, then reproducing that visual information on some sort of reflective surface—or even in his own eyes, if he's particularly skilled. Since photons weigh next to nothing, moving them across great distances requires only a negligible expenditure of energy, although it does get slightly harder to scry the farther away your target is. None of this happens consciously, of course, but that's the basic mechanism underlying the spell.
1. 1. Because scrying relies on electro-magnetic energy, a spellcaster in Alagaësia could scry a dark room and see what it contained, if they knew enough to convert infrared radiation into visible light. By extension, lead, or other similarly dense materials, can block attempts to scry through them, which is why certain caves in Alagaësia are impervious to scrying . . . at least when using normal methods. There are even more advanced techniques, which I won't go into here.
2. 2. Conveying speech from one person to another requires, in most cases, both parties to be active participants. Person A can transmit the information concerning her speech to person B (or person B can be the one to record A's speech and then transfer it to his own location) but, in either case, B has to be the one to reproduce A's speech, and A has to be the one to reproduce B's speech. Why? Because reproduction involves creating vibrations in the air, something which is simply too arduous for anyone to do over more than a few miles. This is why, in Eldest, Eragon was able to scry Nasuada from Ellesméra and listen to her speaking with King Orrin, but he couldn't speak to them in return, since they weren't set up to reproduce his words with an enchanted mirror or some other device.
2. 2. Telepathy, on the other hand, involves actually manipulating physical elements (neurons, synapses, various chemicals, etc.) within another person's brain, which is how one person is able to impress their thoughts and feelings onto the consciousness of another. It doesn't require a huge amount of energy—less than speaking, most often—but, as with moving anything, it becomes exponentially more difficult as the distance between the two people, or other creatures, increases. Some amount of connection can be maintained over great distances, which is why Eragon and Saphira have a vague sense of each other's well-being, or lack thereof, when they are far apart, but it's not enough to allow an exchange of thoughts.
1. 1. If the person whom you are communicating with isn't a telepath as well, then you end up doing double duty—whether you are aware of it or not—as you have to both manipulate their mind and your own, so that you can share in their thoughts and feelings. Otherwise, you would push yourself into their consciousness, but you wouldn't receive anything back. It would be very much a one-sided conversation.
4. 4. Hope that answers your questions!
5. 5. And yes, I spend a lot of time thinking about this.
6. 6. . . . .
7. 7. Too much time probably . . . but I enjoy it.

[dabenjita]

Alright so first off, The Cripple contacted him through reproducing speech, not telapathically. Second, why don't Eragon and Saphira ever do the same when they are seperated?

[ND]

While Eragon lies unconscious after the battle, he is telepathically contacted by a being who identifies himself as Togira Ikonoka—the Cripple Who Is Whole.

That's from the synopsis of Eragon in Eldest.

The answer to the question about Eragon and Saphira is in my previous response.

[AnswerMan]

ND is it possible to shorten the cp answer i tried to read it but after 3andahalf minutes i stopped.

[bPhoenix]

ND is it possible to shorten the cp answer i tried to read it but after 3andahalf minutes i stopped.

The question was about how Arya can speak to Eragon clearly from one end of Alagaesia even if he's at the other end. CP explains that when Arya mentions this, she was not talking about telepathy, but rather a different form of magic, similar to scrying or something I guess.

It pretty much says scrying can be done over vast distances because what you're doing is moving light particles, which are extremely light and easy to move. And to have a conversation, both sides just reproduce the vibration so they can hear one another.

Telepathy, on the other hand, is the manipulation of another brain's physical elements. And since it becomes harder to move things at greater distances, it would be harder to maintain telepathy over vast distances.

Well, it's something along that line anyway. I may have missed some minor details, but that's the gist of it.

This post has been edited by bPhoenix: Oct 18 2009, 11:25 PM

[skulblaka df]

ND is it possible to shorten the cp answer i tried to read it but after 3andahalf minutes i stopped.

The question was about how Arya can speak to Eragon clearly from one end of Alagaesia even if he's at the other end. CP explains that when Arya mentions this, she was not talking about telepathy, but rather a different form of magic, similar to scrying or something I guess.

It pretty much says scrying can be done over vast distances because what you're doing is moving light particles, which are extremely light and easy to move. And to have a conversation, both sides just reproduce the vibration so they can hear one another.

Telepathy, on the other hand, is the manipulation of another brain's physical elements. And since it becomes harder to move things at greater distances, it would be harder to maintain telepathy over vast distances.

Well, it's something along that line anyway. I may have missed some minor details, but that's the gist of it.

For what I see, I think it's all correct. Great post mate (:

[Saeb]

I do believe in another Q&A Session, CP says that it is possible to reach a mind from across Alagaesia using telepathy, except you have to know exactly where the person you are seeking is. Oromis knew, or found out somehow. Also, the bond Eragon and Saphira share is through the same sort of telepathy and is permanent, but it is not the sort of telepathy you can use over vast distances. By this I mean that when you contact a foregin mind over vast distances you single them out and connect with them. But with Eragon and Saphira, he was not specifically trying to locate her mind with those techniques of telepathy (if he was even tought them) but was simply trying to stretch his regular bond with Saphira, which cannot span that many leagues.

[Galbator]

I do believe in another Q&A Session, CP says that it is possible to reach a mind from across Alagaesia using telepathy, except you have to know exactly where the person you are seeking is. Oromis knew, or found out somehow. Also, the bond Eragon and Saphira share is through the same sort of telepathy and is permanent, but it is not the sort of telepathy you can use over vast distances. By this I mean that when you contact a foregin mind over vast distances you single them out and connect with them. But with Eragon and Saphira, he was not specifically trying to locate her mind with those techniques of telepathy (if he was even tought them) but was simply trying to stretch his regular bond with Saphira, which cannot span that many leagues.

When eragon was sleeping and knocked out at some point, he dreamed and spoke to Arya, could Irkona (cant spell) do the same thing