[Auryporry]

How do you write dream sequences? For instance, how does one write a dream sequence where a character is surrounded by a whole bunch of firing rifles, grenade explosions, explosive flash bombs, etc., while not waking them up? I mean...is there a limit as to how loud and/or scary a dream can be before it wakes up a character from sleep?

[Arthryn]

Why are you asking us how 'loud' a dream can be?

How scary/loud would a dream have to be to wake YOU up? Dreams are very open-ended, and if you have to ask about the 'rules' of writing dreams, then... I don't know.

[Survival]

I don't believe there are really any rules to dreams, no more than there are rules to imagination...

[Auryporry]

I don't believe there are really any rules to dreams, no more than there are rules to imagination...

Part of what I'm asking is how does one differentiate a dream sequence from a real life sequence in the novel. I know some people may employ italic characters when writing dreams. I think dream sequences are fine, especially when one ends abruptly and the protagonist wakes up. It's like BANG! A wake up call for all readers! That's good as long as the dream serves relevance to the main plot or theme. Any pointers?

[Survival]

Well, sometimes I tell the reader outright that the character is dreaming. For example, "That night, she had a dream..." and so on.

Other times, you can just dive right into the dream like it's a real life sequence, and sometimes, the reader will know whether it's a dream just becuase of the stuff happening, like if someone dead is talking to them.

Or if it's a very lifelike dream, they just don't find out it's a dream until the character wakes up.

One other pointer is the reader will most likely know it's a dream if the very last scene ended with them drifting off to sleep. They are sleeping, and then suddenly the story is plunged into some strange setting, or right into action.

Italics work fine too... Just whatever you feel comfortablest (excuse my french ) with.

[Invisible Ink]

First, the key to writing dream sequences is paying attention to your own dreams. What kind elements are in your dreams? Do you have the same dream twice? Are you sometimes concious that you're dreaming? If so, does that allow you to control the dream or not? What kind of feelings do you experience during the dreams? Do you remember the dream when you wake up? Or do you remember them after something triggers it in real life, such as a similiar event happening or seeing some one that was in your dream. Try keeping a dream journal for awhile too.

Second, it's important to know how your dreams are going to effect the story and/or character. Like if the character is dreaming about the past, then the dream might be really vivid and you would want to put alot of detail in it. If it's about the future, it might be fuzzy and very confusing and will probably contain symbols. If your dream does contain symbols, you should consider getting yourself a book on dreams and dream meanings. Definitely research symbolism in dreams. If it's a nightmare, I suggest you include details to how the body reacts. I know that when I have a nightmare, my heart beats faster and my muscles get really tense, especially my shoulders and sometimes I clench my hands so hard that when I wake up I have nail-indents in my palms. Is the dream reacurring? And does the character know they're dreaming? What kind of things would let the character know that they're dreaming. One example is being abel to breathe while being underwater. (Which is actually a very cool dream to have) Asking yourself questions like this will defiinitely help develope the sequence.

Writing about how your character wakes up is another way to develope your story overall. Is the character awakened before the dream is over, causing them to miss some important ending? This is useful if your dream is meant to be symbolic and even more so if your character knows it's symbolic and has to see the ending in order to figure something out in the real world. Like Harry's dreams in the Order of the Pheonix where he dreams about the passage way and the room with all the orbs. Or does your character wake themselves up becaue the dream is so scary? Or does the dream end without your character waking up? If it's the last one, you may not even need to put that in your story and can end the dream with a page break or by ending the italics if you're using them.

Another important question to ask is how realistic is the dream? Dreams rarely follow all the laws of the real world. Maybe your character can fly. Maybe they can run super fast or maybe they can't run fast enough. How do these oddities make your character feel? Is there a reason for these oddities or is it just a simple coincidence?

Where does the dream come in in your story? Is the reader reading the dream as it's taking place or is the character remembering the dream? If it's the first, you might want to put more detail in it. If the character is remembering the dream, it's going to be fuzzy and confusing and parts of it will be missing and/or out of order. Combining the two will develope your story too. Maybe your character will forget important details in the dream that you want your reader to know. This is dependant on your writing style and what position you want your reader to be in. Is your reader omnipotent, knowing things your character doesn't, or do they discover things as your character does? If you're writing in first person, you could put the dream in third person let your reader know that it's a dream, or vice versa. Don't forget to include how your character feels about the dream when they remember it or if they remember it at all.

How're you using the dream? Is it a way to give insight into the character's personality? Does it give the reader knowledge of the character's past? Are you using the dream to foreshadow? If foreshadowing be the case I would highly recomend those symbols I keep mentioning. And if you're foreshadowing, our character might not even remember it. This relates back to your writing style, first, second or third person, ect.

Know as much about the dream and how it relates to your character as possible, even if you're not going to put it in your writing.

If you're having problems coming up with a dream for your character to have, try taking things from the dreams you or your friends have had. Having that book on dreams I mentioned before is a way to get ideas too.

I hope this helps. Feel free to ask for help if you need it.

This post has been edited by DracoInkBlood: 08 May 2009 - 11:20 PM

[Regitnui]

There really are no rules when it comes to dream physics. The difference isn't just in the character, the world or 'reality' cna also be warped. For example the classic running towards something that never gets closer. Remember that a character will often not remember every detail, just the moost viscereal or real. A nightmare once woke me up, but i couldn't remember jack about it.

Illusions are also a possible alternative to dream sequences. that's scarier, since someone is manipulating it...

---,-'-@

[Invisible Ink]

That's very true about illusions. An excellent idea for alternatives. But of course, dreams could also contribute to the man vs. self conflict whereas illusions created by another developes a man vs. man conflict. Hallucinations would also work towards man vs. self as hallucinations are usually the mind playing tricks on itself.

[Charles]

God, I hate dream sequences.

I find them about as entertaining as someone telling me their dreams. The whole magical dream thing has just been done and redone and then done again for the sake of it. It's very similar to using fate.

The problems with dreams can be summed up thusly.

1. Your idea of what dreams mean can be completely different to someone else
2. Dreams deal with the subconscious, which is basically a murky fog
3. Any character development in a dream will be very tough to pull off as real
4. Ever have anyone tell you their dreams? Unless you're a psychotherapist, you're likely bored by it. The same is true when it comes to dreams in books.
5. It's commonly a cheap excuse to insert fate.
6. It's commonly used as foreshadowing without the subtlety.

[Invisible Ink]

I disagree, I think dream sequences are usually pretty interesting. And if nothing else, it gives a reader some insight into the character's subconsious and while the subconcious is murky, it can explain why a character feels emotions towards a situation that they don't understand.

[Charles]

I disagree, I think dream sequences are usually pretty interesting. And if nothing else, it gives a reader some insight into the character's subconsious and while the subconcious is murky, it can explain why a character feels emotions towards a situation that they don't understand.

I don't think I've come across a dream sequence I've actually enjoyed reading. One main issue is that it throws up a huge road block in the pacing of the story. If the point is insight into the character's subconscious...why? The subconscious doesn't have a defined parameter, therefore, its explanation of an emotion will always be one of the murkiest quality to the point where it'd just be distracting. It's taking a detour from any real interaction without really settling any character development point.

You're basically dealing with pseudo science or incredibly hypothetical science. To that end, dreams mean incredibly different things to different people. When writing a story, the idea is to be inclusive and not exclusive. When at the heart of the matter, you're commenting on the condition of a human being, throwing up a dream sequence to explain that is throwing up a wall towards the interaction between writer and reader.

[Invisible Ink]

Well you're either a fan of dream sequences or you're not. I personally enjoy wondering the meaning of dreams and I do think that they show alot about the person having them. But it's not just the dream itself, it's also the person's reaction and their own personal interpitation of the dream that can say alot about some one. And yes, the subconcious is murky, but that's kinda the cool thing about it. Different people will interpet things dealing with the subconcious differently and it makes for some awesome discussion. But not only that, it really lets the reader decide how they feel about the character with out it really being forced. Dreams can also be misleading, which can help a writer place red herrings and make the story more interesting.

[Charles]

That's exactly my point. Story telling is meant to be inclusive.

People view dreams has having different meanings. Some view it as important. Some view it as meaningless. Some view it as a scientific necessity. Some view it as a look into the subconscious. Some view it as a look into the future. This is the problem.

If you want the reader to make a judgment call about the character, their actions, dialog, heck, even some insight directly into their thought process is fine. Their history, their environment, so many of these other things exist to not have to resort to an exclusionary way of story telling.

I know from personal experience, like many other people, that I've had a number of dreams that were just weird, served no purpose, or really say nothing about my personality. Maybe underlying drives described as Freud as id, but any deeper meaning? I just don't see it in my own life or in the lives of other people that explain their dreams to me. I don't know why I would treat it differently in a book unless the book makes specific points as to the purpose of dreams.

[Invisible Ink]

I don't see how using a dream to help develope a character would be considered exclusive unless a writer had completely forgone the other parts of character developement. Dreams alone should not be used to develope a character, no, but using them as a different means to develope them, that's different and a nice change of pace than simply coming right out and saying that Bob was a sad little boy who grew into an emo kid and killed himself because he had no friends because of his lack of happy thoughts and his inability to make small talk due to his shyness. And it's not the dream alone that gives the reader a look into the character's thoughts and feelings, but dreams paired with the character's interpetation.

Let's say Bob had a dream about standing in a field of flowers and then he took out his lighter and set it ablaze and ended up dieing in the fire. Bob then comes up with two explanations for his dream: 1: he's a bit of a pyro and probably should be more careful with lighters and fields of flamable objects or 2: he's a self-destructive person and needs to pay more attention to his surroundings and realize that they're not as bad as they seem. If Bob decided on option 1 as his way of interpeting dreams, I would say see Bob as a straighforward and blunt person who takes things very literally. If he decided on option 2, I would say that Bob is the type of person to think things out, to find the hidden meanings. He reads behind the lines and maybe has the possibility for a great passion in his religious beliefs, especially if Bob had gone so far as to find a book on dream interpetation and tried to discover the meaning of his dream.

Either option gives you character developement and room for the reader to develope the character farther in their minds because let's face it, no matter how hard an author tries, they simply cannot put every detail about their character onto the paper and I as a reader enjoy considering the possible developments for a character without having the author forcing information down my throat. It makes me feel part of the story instead of just a reader staring at words on a page. It's interactive reading. And if you consider that exclusive, well, that's your opinion.

[Charles]

My opinion of the character Bob in that circumstance is that he first of all has a pretty impressive recall for his dreams, and on top of that he has some serious issues from making decisions based on dreams. Whenever I see a character have a dream, and then feel like it has some meaningful impact on the character, I just see that as a red flag the author is throwing up. We dream every night, usually multiple dreams. The work of a writer is really the work of a director of a series of events. They're picking and choosing what events are important. When you throw in the dream, it's basically a cop out to be like, here's all of this interpretative stuff that I can go any way with because it's a dream. It seems cheap and easy for that reason.

Regarding the first paragraph. You can have subtlety in writing while still giving insight to the character's mind without having to result in the subconscious. Little things.

Example, character is getting married. During the ceremony he is continually shifting his eyes from the bride towards the door. What does this mean? It's interpretation. The point is, we can put possible conclusions together ourselves.

While it's true that how a character interacts to a dream could very well develop the character, the actual action of the dream will remain, to me, as merely complicated mumbo jumbo for people to attempt to put pieces together.

I will say that I'm ignoring Harry Potter with this to a large degree. When it's established his dreams are real, they no longer are part of some process for extraction. We all have minds that work differently. As the director, you're not giving a full work up of every thought the character has. Maybe their dream is affected in this way because their hamster died when they were 5. Honestly, there's no way of knowing unless the author loses the subtlety. At that point, they might as well just come out and tell you like your example in the first paragraph.

I'm definitely not saying an author should force information down someone's throat. Quite the contrary.

The key for not forcing down information in the form of character development, to me, is actions people take, words people say, body language, or insight into character thoughts. If they conflict, you have all the interpretation in the world. If a character is saying to himself, "I am a good person," but had just killed someone because of military orders, you have all kinds of interpretation. Slight fluctuations in any of those things will get across to more people than dealing with the subconscious directly, which is what dreams are thought by some people to do.

Emphasis on some people. Dream science is extremely soft.