How did Murtagh access his HoH's? Options

[Saeb]

If Murtagh or Thorn ate the Eldunari they would either be digested, or they would die of indigestion, so that option should really be out of the question. It seems too farfetched and silly in my eyes, anyway.

This post has been edited by Saeb: Sep 20 2009, 06:39 AM

[GreekFan]

Murtagh keeps them with him.Eragon noticed it in their last fight

[dark count]

look back for clues i missed but here are a few, brom in his first story says galby learned dark secrets from a shade and oromis, although he says it would be unnatural does NOT say more than one consuosness can exsist in a body (that would be lying)i think that galby request when he awoke was either to put his dragons eldunari in a new body or possibly he had his dragons consousness within his body and blames the elders for stripping it from him thus in his mind killing his dragon (thats why he was insane?) and the secrets he learned from durza was the making of a shade from a spirits point of view, how to dominate them and bind them ect. so he twisted sorcery to suite his own needs and enslave dragons instead of humans or spirits. the seer eragon meets says murtagh was a shell of a man and that the light shone through him, possibly galby has made himself and murtagh versions of shades, although my end conclusions are possibly wrong that which i based them on is correct im sure. also if murtagh physicaly possed or had them inserted physicaly into himself or thorn the seer would have noticed like he did eragons stores of energy, i also give credit to the idea of thorns heart touching the others as that would be the reason galby doesnt leave urubean, cause he doesnt wanna leave them vulnurable

This post has been edited by dark count: Sep 29 2009, 02:14 AM

[DaveO9]

I like Dave09's theory. It seems like the most logical and most like CP's style.

Hey thanks!

By the way, people get your facts right please. The link between a dragon and an eldunari is very special, one that is not affected by distance, remember that they are a single being. This means that the energy would not be affected by distance due to this link. See Brisingr when Eragon is informed of the eldunari he learns all this.

I very much doubt that Galby does not have Thorn's eldunari next to the ones he has assigned to Murtagh. There is evidence that he has them together:

First point, Galby poses Murtagh when he is fighting Oromis. How can he possibly do this over such an immense distance? Easily, he needs only touch Thorn's eldunari and he can access Murtagh's mind without problem.

Second point, he lifts both riders and their dragons to incredible heights and maintains them there for a long time, and even claims he can do it indefinitely (Which is an obvious lie unless there are so many eldunari that they can replenish enough energy for him to do this). Due to the distance the amount of energy to perform this kind of magic without some kind of connection would be immensely more than what is already an incredible feat, if we consider that there is virtually no energy loss from distance if done via eldunari.

Anyway, I have a theory, though I have no support from the series, that due to the nature of magic Galby must be the channel of all this energy, because the eldunari are not performing it, he is merely taking the energy from them, so it has to pass through his body first, such a staggering amount of energy passing through him would surely destroy him. However if done via the connection of Thorn and his eldunari he has to channel less energy and through a safer mean.

And of course my third and most important point. Put yourself in Galby's shoes. If you were a megalomaniac king in search of becoming invincible you would probably be a little tiny wee bit paranoid... albeit a very cunning and perceptive paranoid. Surely you would realize the advantages of keeping your slaves eldunari with you...

You can control his every move and contact him without problem. You could provide him with cost free energy or take it away from him. In case anything happened you could threaten to hurt his dragon, or control him, although I am not sure if Galby knows but it could be a way of preventing Murtagh from escaping him if their true names changed... There is no risk of the eldunari being lost or stolen and especially if Murtagh was killed they could not be used by Eragon himself...

Whilst if you give your servant a bunch of eldunari... Well I won't repeat the problems that could make...

On the other side of the argument dragons are beasts of incredible power, if Glaedr's eldunari was relatively small in size for his own size, although still quite big, then surely that of younger dragons would be much smaller, even dragons much older than Saphira would have very small eldunari considering that Glaedr was immensely old by any reconning. Unless the eldunari are disproportionate in size to their age, and inherently so to the size of the dragon, I calculate that the eldunari of a dragon the age and size of Saphira would probably be no bigger than a quarter of an inch whilst that of a dragon around 100 years of age would probably be around an inch. (Remember that the rate of their growing decreases with time, and so probably their eldunari.)

What I mean to say is that with ten or twelve small eldunarya Murtagh could easily be that many time more powerfull, and eldunari that size would be easy to hide, for example in a pocket. The only advantage I can see that this argument has over the one of keeping all the eldunari together, in Uru'baen presumably, is that if Murtagh's mind was attacked with enough strength he would be separated from his source of energy, while not in the case he had them close by.

To refute this however one can say that the combined minds of the eldunari make him much stronger in a mental attack so this is unlikely(Remember the fight at the end of Eldest it says Eragon was attacked with more strength than even Oromis could summon).

Well I have extended myself a little but I have given this much thought, I hope that what I say is clear, I tend to ramble on and on and people get bored and ignore what I say, hoping that is not the case;

Dave

This post has been edited by DaveO9: Oct 2 2009, 02:56 AM

[Deej]

I believe it maybe possible for a dragon to actually engorge other eldunari into themselves. Where they would be stored though I've no idea, perhaps they are actually "abosrbed" into the dragons own eldunari or body. That would fit in with what the blind man was talking about with the "Multiple lights" within Thorn and Murtagh. Because as Eragon said, they saw no satchel or other holding device on Murtagh's person.

Problem is, Eragon never thought to ask Oromis about that in the books, so whether it's actually doable is up to debate.

[IAmEragonBromSon]

I'm totally in agreement with the whole, "Murtagh had them somewhere nearby" idea. I mean what if Murtagh was just kept in contact with them exactly the same way that Eragon was connected with Arya, Blodgharm, and the other elves? He could just establish contact with them like he does with Thorn and just not block his mind to them. Any thoughts?

-IAmEragonBromSon