[quakerbuck]

Hey everyone.. I've been reading these forums for quite a while now, but only recently began to post (as my post count can testify to). I'm currently writing a book series, and I need some advice on my supreme or "Ruling" Races.

In the story there are four ruling races (the number is significant). Creatures of intelligence are obviously needed if they are to rule above the smaller races, so I came up with these four: humans, elves, dwarves, and centaurs. The humans are absolutely necessary and the centaurs fit extremely well to the story. My problem is that elves and dwarves are used so much in all types of fantasy books, and I feel like I'm copying all the great fantasy writers out there (Tolkien, Paolini, and Rowling just to name a few).

Anyone have any ideas or advice that could help me get over this barrier? It would be greatly appreciated.

[Behave Yourself]

1. You called Paolini a great fantasy writer, but all he did was derive from other stories. Trust me, the further you get into actually being original, the more you realize that he is certainly not a master of fantasy.

2. Okay, what you do with these races is make them your own. Make them original, or at least most of the designs should be your own creation. High fantasy is great, but it doesn't necessarily need to be derived. When I made a high fantasy I never completed, I made humans have the ability to change mindsets and the Dwarves stuck to them completely, while the Elves were completely screwed and pretty much eternally ADHD. My originality in them was basic psychology. Think of things that would work with your characters, but remember --- drawbacks should be put in to make sure nothing you give them is too powerful for the universe, and make sure that it sounds believable in the rules of your world and not pulled out of your ass.

James

[Arthryn]

What's so hard about making up your own races? No one is saying you MUST use elves and dwarves, or even your 'own' races that are mostly like elves and dwarves, but with different superficial details.

What do these races need to be like? Do they even need to be humanoid? You could, for example, have a race called the Naethi that walk on two legs, but have hoofed feet, and have manes and deer-like faces. The Naethi are reclusive and peaceful, but their culture is ingrained with dogmatic beliefs about spirits of nature. They are known for building monolithic stone temples in forests.

There. I just pulled a new, original race out of my ass. Now it's your turn!

[Ayaka Dirutia]

I agree with Arthryn - don't be afraid to create your own races! You can create a whole new culture, language, world, etc. for them that would help you get away from this stereotypical barrier you speak of.

[Invisible Ink]

You could also look to mythology for ideas. I'm not saying copying myths or anything, but look at the different creatures in mythology. Maybe that would give you some good ideas.

[quakerbuck]

Thanks guys, that really helped.

[Fusaichi Pegasus]

Do you even need races? Why not try various human cultures? One of my favourite High Fantasy authors, David Eddings, had a series of different cultures in each of his books. It worked for him and done right, it will work for you. Give each of your cultures their own traits even languages if need be (though if you don't know enough about how languages work than this can be bad...)

[Kari]

Looking to mythology is an excellent idea. Nymphs, for example, or real fairy folk.

I seriously advise against trying to create a language for your world. If you must have a different language, which your hero doesn't know, just mention 'he heard the strange syllables, but could make neither heads nor tails of them' or something to that effect. Easier by far (DON'T pull a Paolini and force your reader to go back to the dictionary all the time. It's horrid).

[dragonking555]

What about golems? People who appear human but are in fact able to shape shift and redefine themselves being made from clay. You can add your own mythology about how they came to be.

The Sea People are also cool. People who can remain underwater indefinitely so they have built an entire civilization underwater.

You could base your main races around each geographical location. For example.

Forest: Centaurs

Mountains: Golems

Oceans: Sea People

Plains: Humans

The possibilities are pretty much endless for what you can do. Feel free to take these ideas if you want, I'm not using them for anything.

[quakerbuck]

Hey everyone just wanted to say thanks again for all the advice. After thinking much on the subject, I came up with 3 new races to call my own (hopefully they haven't been used before )

The following is an excerpt from my book:

"...Lush forests and rolling plains covered Solenusia’s landscape, while lakes and rivers wove in between mountains and valleys. It was a truly pure beauty to behold, and all the races lived together in harmony, especially the four supreme: humans, trindgaly, iglava, and volderon.
"For now, I shall describe each of the three races that are foreign to you only briefly enough so you may understand what they are like, for you will learn about them all in greater detail in time. The trindgaly are an extremely proud, yet solitary race. They live in woodland areas mostly, and are known for keeping to themselves and staying well out of the affairs of others. The only thing that surpasses the pride of a trindgaly is it’s knowledge, for they have ‘studied all the world twice over’, or so they say.” Trainor gave Brett a small smirk as he said this, which caused Brett to chuckle softly. “The iglava are the craftsman of Solenusia,” Trainor continued. “They are known for their massive stone cities which still stand, although they were built centuries ago. Iglava are also accomplished metal workers, and humans were never able to quite become as renown as Iglava for their armor and weaponry. Finally, if you wanted any being of Solenusia alongside you for a battle it would be a volderon. They are easily the race most skilled with a sword and spear, and those abilities along with their knowledge and tactics for battle make them truly formidable.”

[dragonking555]

You described for us what each race is like or good at but besides that I am not sure what they are or even what they look like. Just giving us a little overview would be cool.

[quakerbuck]

^^Yes, I know.. I'm currently working on the long description chapter so as soon as that's done I'll post it.

[Morzansspawn]

They all seems to have dwarf and elf traits in them .

[Arthryn]

Yeeeahh.. hate to say it, but these really don't sound like distinct new races. You could pass them off as different cultures of human. Also, you've listed traits that are commonly attributed to the stock elves and dwarves. Which are boring and worn.

I think what people have a hard time with new, non-human races is the part where they are not human. They can be like humans, but then again they are not. When I see a non-human fantasy race, I want to really see and feel the non-humanness and distinctness of that race.

I would spend some time not only building up the appearance and trades of the races, but really delve down into the very nature of your race. We talk about human nature a lot in writing, but what are the natures of your new races? How do they think? How do they interpret good and evil? What sort of motives are they driven by? Are they as social as humans? More social? Quick to anger? Do they go to war? What are these races all about?

Try writing up a description of each of your new races in which you summarize their history, describe what they look like, and compare them to humans and tell us how they are different. You don't need to compare them to humans, but it would be a good start to help you see the relative differences between them.

[Hresvelgr]

Yeah, basically what she said. Keep in mind that differences aren't always physical. Nor do different races always acknowledge themselves as being the different ones. For all it's faults, I actually quite liked bits of Eldest, especially the drunken rant by Orik about how he wasn't short, humans were the giants. For all its cliches, I rather enjoyed that little gem. Few enough authors actually recognize that perceptions change.